Curious about an error

Discussion and analysis about certain positions.

Curious about an error

Postby Pedro Saavedra on Sat Sep 02, 2006 12:27 pm

I have an edition of Lee's Guide, where I do not have the year (eraly pages are missing) but it says "New Edition, Revised and Enlarged by J.W. Dawson"

I just wasted several minutes of my life trying to solve a problem which is given as "Black to move and win". After I gave up, I looked up the answer and found that it should have said "White to move and win".

The problem is number 51 by J. Tyrie and it's actually quite enjoyable (and not that difficult) if you know the right terms. I have several questions:

1) Was the error corrected in other editions?

2) Does the problem appear in earlier editions (with or without the error)?

3) Is there any source in the Internet I can consult in case I am curious about a problem composer? I see many names that have given me enjoyment, but I know absolutely nothing about them.
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Mr. Checkers on Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:21 pm

Pedro how many pages are there in your Lees' Guide--155,163,173,174,208,248, 271 or 267, etc?
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Bob Murr on Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:52 pm

I checked in 3 Lees' guides and all have the terms of problem 51 as "Black to move and win" with the solution showing a white win.
One book with 271 pages and 2 books with 208 pages. One of the 208 page books was published by Gould & Sons, Middlesbrough, England and the other by David McKay, Philadelphia.
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Mr. Checkers on Sun Sep 03, 2006 5:58 pm

Bob the 208 page edition came out from 1912-1919. The 271 page edition came out in 1930-31; plus it was reprinted in the 1980's. There are at least 3 different pamphlets with corrections to Lees' Guide. Many checker books have errors in them, so that is nothing new--no book is perfect, therefore errors are to be expected--even in 2006 releases.
Last edited by Mr. Checkers on Mon Sep 04, 2006 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Pedro Saavedra on Mon Sep 04, 2006 2:00 pm

Ms Becky says:

> There are also 3 different pamphlets with corrections to Lees' Guide. As
> far of any errors in them--no book is perfect, so those are to be
> expected--even in 2006 releases.

Oh, absolutely. Lee's guide is one of my favorite books. I was just curious about how long it takes for somebody to catch these errors if ever. This is different from errors where a move loses and the analyst overlooked it. This is the kind of typo that anybody who tries to solve the problem can catch. The wonder is that nobody caught it and wrote at the early stages.

Just out of curiosity, is it listed in the errata?

Pedro
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Mr. Checkers on Mon Sep 04, 2006 5:45 pm

Pedro I think you will find that there are more "dog catchers" to be found in this world of ours than there are "catchers of errors in checkers books", but this is just my personal oberservation. It has only been recently with the advent of computers that corrections have been discovered in past checker literature. Some past authors, such as Ben Boland issued corrections to their books, but those were the exceptions to the rule. Corrections to errors made today are frequently corrected again tomorrow by others, as new checker technology unfolds and as new discovers are made. Before the electron microscope we were told that there were 24 pairs of human chromosomes, but today that number has changed to 23 pairs, so life still goes on regardless if you had or have 23 or 24 pairs. Checkers today is being put (one might say) under the electron microscope, so expect more discoveries to be made in the future of our game, and with that changes in play will surely follow. P.S. you neglected to tell me how many pages are in your Lees' Guide?
Take care and God Bless. "Mr. Checkers"---Visit with "Inky" at: http://www.broenink-art.nl/maukie2.swf----"No act of kindness no matter how small is ever wasted". --Aesop--
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Gene Lindsay on Mon Sep 04, 2006 11:07 pm

Ms Becky, you are very naive if you think these errors in checker books are only now being discovered. I have several checker books that I bought used that have corrections written in them. In the past there was no forum to post these errors on when you found them. Most checker players expected to find errors in their books from time to time, so when they found them they corrected their copy and when on. I do not know who had my Lee's Guide before I bought it but it has been corrected(crossed out and written in ink).


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Re: Curious about an error

Postby EdTrice on Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:32 am

Gene Lindsay wrote:...so when they found them they corrected their copy and when on. ...


And just to be funny, Gene, you meant "went on", so correct that too.

:)
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Mr. Checkers on Tue Sep 05, 2006 12:21 pm

Gene you obviously mis-read my posting here, so go back and reread it in the light in which it was written. Most checker books (old or new) that have errors in them were not corrected professionally (you mentioned they may have been corrected by individuals reading them) either by their authors or by their publishers. I mentioned the Ben Boland issued a few corrections to some of his books and that Lees' Guide was corrected somewhat, but even with that no books were put under the microscope like they are today with all of the new checker programs and technology that is available to us. Errors are a fact of life which we all have to learn to live with--and the older that I have become the more of them seem to come my way.
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Gene Lindsay on Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:17 pm

Ms Becky, I reread it but it still says the same thing. You said, "It has only been recently with the advent of commputers that corrections have been discovered in past checker literature." And I say,"nonsense".

Gene Lindsay[/quote]
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Gene Lindsay on Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:18 pm

Ms Becky, I reread it but it still says the same thing. You said, "It has only been recently with the advent of commputers that corrections have been discovered in past checker literature." And I say,"nonsense".

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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Mr. Checkers on Tue Sep 05, 2006 2:45 pm

Gene I don't know where you have been, but it seems like every week that someone posts new improvements and corrections to old play found in past checker literature. In any case your observations have been duly noted.
Take care and God Bless. "Mr. Checkers"---Visit with "Inky" at: http://www.broenink-art.nl/maukie2.swf----"No act of kindness no matter how small is ever wasted". --Aesop--
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Pedro Saavedra on Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:15 pm

First my answer on my edition, I cannot tell exactly, but the last page with a number in it says 208. Since it is missing pages in the front it could be missing pages in the back.

I do think that it surprised me that a magnificent work published in many editions did not have somebody go through it or did not act on any inquiries on something like a problem where the wrong side is given to move and win. I had imagined that such works would be proofed between editions. That the error occurred in the first place is understandable, but that it persisted over several editions did surprise me. Particularly because it is a nifty problem, and I can see many players trying their hand at it and being a bit frustrated at not having the right terms in the first place. This does not take away from Lee's Guide being one of my favorite books.
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Mr. Checkers on Tue Sep 05, 2006 7:54 pm

Pedro I would suggest that you may want to think about purchasing the latest version of Lees' Guide, which has 267 pages. The 208 page version is from 1912-1919.
Take care and God Bless. "Mr. Checkers"---Visit with "Inky" at: http://www.broenink-art.nl/maukie2.swf----"No act of kindness no matter how small is ever wasted". --Aesop--
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Re: Curious about an error

Postby Palomino on Tue Sep 05, 2006 8:07 pm

Hi Pedro,

I have two books, one has 248 pages the other has 271 pages, the book with 271 pages has-- PUBLISHER'S PREFACE TO THE 1931 EDITION-- page. Both of my books have the same typo error on page 196 (SELECTED POSITION # 51. J. Tyrie) "Black to move and win" that your book has.

I agree that it seems strange that at some point this typo was not corrected. "Mr. Checkers" has told me that there were more than 100 different printings of this book from the first printing in 1892 to the most recent printing which was sometime in the 1980s.

It would be interesting to know if any printing of the book had it correct.

Regards, "Pal" Bucker
Last edited by Palomino on Wed Sep 06, 2006 10:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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