Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby kim willis on Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:55 am

I think in my own opinion that no federations as the ACF or any association needs the WCDF, For me I say boycott, We as players should take a stand now. Each of us should do what we can to keep this game alive.

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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Danny_Alvarez on Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:03 pm

kim willis wrote: ...I say boycott, ....Each of us should do what we can to keep this game alive.


Kim, I am not trying to pick an argument with you, but can you please explain how boycotting the WCDF you are helping to keep the game alive???

Cheers
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Ingo_Zachos on Wed Nov 17, 2010 12:41 pm

kim willis wrote:As for me I seen rules broken and nothing being done about it


Kim, fas ar as I know your opponent was warned, so it is simply not true that nothing has been done.

Could you agree on that?



Greetinx from Germany,

Ingo
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby kim willis on Wed Nov 17, 2010 1:56 pm

Hi danny,
Okay may i ask you a question? What has the WCDF done for you and others? I was at the irish open and WQ. Not one called to a tv station. radio, newspaper. Is that promoting the game? Where do we draw a line. We as players can do the promoting. Do you promote the game? Do u see my point.

kim

This to Ingo, Warning??????????????????? Do you call that fair to me or any other player. Does that mean I can go to my room? Does that mean I can do whatever i want. Rules are rules it should have been a forfeit period.

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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Ingo_Zachos on Wed Nov 17, 2010 2:44 pm

Hi Kim,

the WCDF is not the organizer of the QT or the IO.
Actully the WCDF never hosted any event, and has not even the equipment to do that so far.
The IDA was the host, endorsed by the WCDF.

And the refree decided in your favor and warned your opponent.


Greetinx,

Ingo
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby kiwinurse on Wed Nov 17, 2010 2:58 pm

According to the rules,written,there should have been a forfeit Ingo,not a warning.If the WCDF didnt run this world qualifier,why did we pay 100 euros to attend?This was a WCDF world qualifier.
Like ive said before on here, the qualifier was well run by the referrees,except for that incident,and if it had been me i would have asked for a default of that game,and i told the referree that at the time.
Whats written needs to be put in place.And also the powers that be who are running the WCDF need to listen to the players,when there is a legitimate complaint.
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Ingo_Zachos on Wed Nov 17, 2010 3:54 pm

Kim, where are this written rules?

WCDF:
http://wcdf.wz.cz/rules.htm

ACF:
http://www.usacheckers.com/rulesofcheckers.php

Note that here number 13 as well as the WCDF rules forbid to stand up or walking out during a game
It does not say that after a game or between two games a player may stand up and leave.
And it does not give a forfeit as sanction.
Not in WCDF rules or ACF rules.

The case has been ruled, and it has been ruled in your favor.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The WCDF receives 100 Dollar by each of its member federations per annum.
That is, and was never, a starting fee.
However, any federation wanting to play in a WCDF-endorsed event have to pay their fees, or their players are not allowed to enter.

And now calculate: With 17 federations how much is that?
And how much price money could be awarded with that?

Do you now see that the WCDF is not the organizer, and not a money-wasting machine?
Actually, Liam Stephens is right if he points out that all prices are set up by the IDA.

And may I say that my personal critique is not that the price money is too low.
Nor do I think that money has been hold back by the IDA or any other on purpose.
But is seems as many players, like you Kim, are suspicious that they did not get the money that was announced.

It seems as if the program was not clear enough on that point.



Greetinx from Germany,

Ingo
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby kiwinurse on Wed Nov 17, 2010 5:16 pm

Many apologies Ingo about the law being written for forfeiting the game.Why did i assume it was there?I was positive i read it.But in so saying the sensible and fair thing to do in the scenario of a player leaving the match before the second 3 move is played and going to her room for 15-20 minutes should have been a forfeit anyway.One of the referrees said that Toyeva had asked permission to go upstairs,and so maybe the fault lies with the referree and not Toyeva.By the way both referrees were very nice men,and referreed the match very fairly in other circumstances.This was a lapse in judgement i feel.Toyeva herself is a sweet lady.
BUT the fact remains that this should not be happening and an automatic forfeit should happen,and should be written in the rules as such.Im sure if you looked at the chess rules it would be an automatic forfeit.The laws an :!: and needs revision.
Too many years have gone by both in America and in the WCDF where there are tales of cheating going on,sometimes in subtle ways.Which puts our game into disrepute.Forget about the prize money,whats more important is that games are fair,especially when we travel so far to play.
Now another rule states that players arent allowed to hover over games or walk around when playing.This is another rule that isnt enforced in both organizations.Why isnt it? Because the mans a master and we dont dare upset him>Maybe hes got a lot of money,we better not rock the boat!There should be the same rule for everyone,man or woman!
I liked the qualifier in the fact that if two or more people belonged to the one organization,they played their first games then were split up for the rest of the match,thus stopping any cheating.
When players pay big money to come overseas to play,none of these silly wee things should happen.
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Danny_Alvarez on Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:16 pm

Kim, aren't we all human? I am sure that the powers that be given another crack at this would've handled it better.
To forgive is divine. We all make mistakes. If we all got fired, replaced or boycotted when we make a mistake it would be a sad world.
While what happened to you is unfortunate, it's not the end of the world, we get other chances to play, referee, participate.

Ingo, I fear that you really do not understand the nature of 3-move if you think it is ok to have a break and go and consult literature or
computers or people after only one half of a 3 move match has been completed.

Jan I agree totally, I think this was a "lapse in judgement" and nothing else. I also liked how you ended your post on a positive note.
Surely, everything wasn't all that bad. I've heard some very positive comments.

Regards,
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby kiwinurse on Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:22 pm

Is anyone else experiencing words being jumbled up or taken out of context or disappearing after writing a piece for the forum. Very strange.Its been happening to me since yesterday,and im not on anything!One minute the passage is ok,the next minute the words are mixed up. Very strange!
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Irma Sierra on Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:50 pm

ME, JAN.....words dissapear and appear again, I had read your post asking where ur words went..is horrible!
just lady.......
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Irma Sierra on Wed Nov 17, 2010 6:52 pm

Daniel:

I dare you to tell Alex Moseyev to forgive the fault the refferees made....tell him he will have another chance, another day....come on...do it!
just lady.......
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Danny_Alvarez on Wed Nov 17, 2010 8:24 pm

Irma, I think no matter how big or small my message applies for everyone, including Alex. He is fortunate that he doesn't have to rely on referees decisions and i could probably play him with a whole library next to me and still lose :).

I am trying to make you fine people see that there is no need to be so intransigent. Surely everyone here has made mistakes before.
Are you guys perfect? My point is this there was no malice behind the incident with Kim and Toyeva. And there was no malice by the lack of
publicity. Can we move on? I am assuming like i said before somewhere else that past organizers and future ones are reading this and they
will endeavour to rectify this issues. Isn't that enough?

Let's put this into perspective, please
Cheers,
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby Alex_Moiseyev on Wed Nov 17, 2010 11:04 pm

The end of this unfortunate story must be as following:

Inaccurate rule must be reviewed by WCDF Rules Committee, update and replace the word "game" by word "round"".

Everyone must be under observation by referee, referee assistant or event officals until round is in progress.

I remember one time Ron King between 1st and 2nd game wanted to go to his room for medicine and he invited someone to walk with him to avoid conflict.

ACF rules enforce fortfeit only as result of second warning.

Regards,

Alex
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Re: Report of the Irish Open by Igor Martynov

Postby kiwinurse on Thu Nov 18, 2010 12:59 am

Nothing wrong with Ron doing that Alex,that was all kocher and above board.Ron was a keen advocate for the women at the qualifier,i was quite proud of him.
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